Being Jewish with Jonah Platt

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Jonah: [00:00:00] British essayist William Hazlitt once wrote, The only vice that cannot be forgiven is hypocrisy. Clearly, Hazlitt was not a Jew, or he'd know all about Teshuvah, the Jewish practice of seeking forgiveness and self improvement. But his point is well taken. There are few things in life that irk my soul more than the complete lack of humility on display when an oblivious person demonstrates the very behavior they claim to stand against.

This is doubly true for me when the culprit is a Jew. Yes, Jews are human beings, fallible as any other, but we are supposed to live our lives according to the highest moral code. I don't even mean the specific laws or commandments or rituals. I mean the ethos, the core values, the penteleyed, that spark of Jewish essence inside us.

Unfortunately, my high regard for the moral character of my tribe and my distaste for hypocrisy came into a cacophonous clash this past fall in the hundred days of Kamala Harris's [00:01:00] campaign for President of the United States. I'd never seen anything like it. But let me first set the stage. As I assume most of you listening to this are aware.

The 13 months from October 2023 to November 2024 were hell. The Jewish people found ourselves in a Balagan unlike anything we've seen for generations. We are still living through this terrible moment that began on October 7th and has continued every day since. Defending ourselves from those who seek to destroy us, both literally and symbolically, in Israel and across the Western world.

The only possible antidote to all this anti Jew venom, the only chance we have to stand strong against it, is to be a loving, supportive, unified Jewish community. We must do as the Roman battalions once did. Stand in lockstep, each shielding the other in phalanx formation, or we'll have no chance of beating back the superior numbers of our enemies.

Sadly, despite this existential threat, with a new presidential [00:02:00] administration on the line, the Jewish community elected not to come together. Instead, we wasted no time cannibalizing ourselves over political disagreement, in a messy and public way that was antithetical to everything Judaism is about. The polarization pitfall was ready and waiting, and the Jews jumped right in.

And let me be clear, this was never an issue of which side was right or wrong. As I explained on episode two of this show, there was a clear and reasonable case to be made for Jews to support either candidate. What it boiled down to was this. Jews on the left, which is by far most Jews. Could not stomach voting for a candidate in Donald Trump, who they saw as being the best example of the worst kind of person.

A man who has swindled seniors and foreign workers and his own employees out of their money, who's lied at a greater rate than any human in history, disparaged every kind of identity imaginable, oversaw the country's first violent transfer of power, and to this day, continues to undermine the integrity of our nation's election system.[00:03:00]

Answer honestly, which Jewish values are present in these behaviors? And so, most left leaning Jews chose to hold their noses and vote for an imperfect candidate and an imperfect party who at least overlapped with some of their Jewish values, rather than choose a man who wouldn't know a Jewish value if it smacked him in the face.

On the right, Jews were concerned about the situation in Israel and the safety of Jews in America. Period. They saw in the Democratic Party a constant mealy mouthed equivocation, pandering to the party's most anti Jewish elements. Decisions of rhetoric or optics that undercut Israel's ability to win the war in swift and decisive fashion.

Surely, the most important Jewish value is the preservation of the Jewish people themselves, or so the thinking might go, and so right leaning Jews held their noses and voted for a highly indecent and immoral person, or did so admiringly, which is a whole different essay. Rather than vote for a candidate and party they saw as being unsympathetic, uncaring, and actually dangerous for the Jewish community.[00:04:00]

Again, both of these positions are totally valid. But you would never know it from the way Jews began attacking each other. I spend a lot of my time pushing back against virulent anti Jew bigots online who leave me nasty, ignorant comments and DMs constantly. And honestly, the invective I received from Republicans supporting Jews this fall was among the most abhorrent and disrespectful of any I've seen in my time as a Jewish advocate.

And I'm a Jewish advocate. Where was the derech eretz? The Jewish value of common decency and respect? Where was the sense of common cause? Out the window, from the people who should be holding themselves to the highest ethical standard. This ugly clash between political ideology and communal solidarity.

Raises a critical question for Jews and for any group navigating divisive times. How do we balance our individual convictions with the pragmatic and moral imperative to stand together as a [00:05:00] community? From the left, I heard exasperation, frustration, dismissal, and condescension of those who would dare to approach the situation from a different point of view.

And while I can understand the reflex to be horrified at support for Donald Trump for all the reasons I already outlined, I cannot justify the rush to demonize our own brothers and sisters and their refusal to even attempt to understand them. We're supposed to be better than this. Moreover, many Jewish voices and media outlets fanned the flames of this embarrassing discord.

On the right, I saw Jewish influencers openly trolling, bullying, and insulting other Jewish figures on the left. I saw inflammatory and divisive videos on both sides. Gleefully painting our own community members as the enemy. I saw Jewish media dropping incendiary, biased articles, clearly meant to stoke the flames and rile people up.

I saw a few attempts, if any, to calm the waters and promote unity. Thankfully, the election [00:06:00] is over, and the internecine fighting has quieted down. A new regime has taken the reins of power in this country, and if it's anything like the last Trump administration, we're going to be seeing and hearing our president on the news every day.

Saying and doing things that some will applaud and others will deplore. As we step deeper into this uncharted new year, my hope for our people is that we remember ourselves, our values, our essence. That we not allow fear, as powerful a motivator as it can be, to supersede our higher thinking and holy ethical code.

If hypocrisy has any saving grace, it's that we can shut it down as soon as we become aware of it. Let's hope the Jewish community gets hip to our own hypocrisy, because unlike agreeing on politics, the stability and survival of our free and liberal way of life depends on it. So next time, before you hit send on that tweet, or text, or DM, remember, Where Jews were supposed to be better than this.[00:07:00]

This is the 18th episode of Being Jewish, with me, Jonah Platt.

For whatever reason, Jews love to hoop. My guest today is a hooper who loves Jews. He is a legend in the sports world, not just for his defensive prowess or iconic playoff shot making. for his resilience, his candor, and his advocacy, which makes him a natural fit for this podcast. He's been outspoken about mental health issues, women's sports, and most recently, supporting the [00:08:00] Jewish community and doing real work to understand the conflict overseas.

And so, Ladies and gentlemen, that small forward, standing 6'7 260 pounds, from St. John's, NBA All Star, Defensive Player of the Year, and NBA Champion, Met us and deferred our test. We

Metta: in the building, baby. We in the building.

Jonah: Yeah, we in the

Metta: building. Good to see you, man. It's great to see you.

Jonah: Great to have you here.

I know,

Metta: I know. It's good to be here. Thanks for having me on the podcast.

Jonah: So, first of all, Mazel Tov on your new child. Thank you, How many kids do you have now?

Metta: Yeah, five children.

Jonah: Amazing.

Metta: Seventy nieces and nephews. Seventy? Seventy. I mean, you're counting the great Okay, great. But

Jonah: still, that's, that's quite a number when you're

Metta: counting other nieces and nephews I've acquired Along my journey, which I love.

I love them dearly and then two grandchildren.

Jonah: Two grandchildren? Yeah. Wow. Blessings, man. Yeah. Okay, so I want to start with the [00:09:00] obvious. The obvious question that I think probably most people listening and watching this are thinking which is What the hell is Metta World Peace doing on this Jewish podcast?

And I want to start that with how we met. Right. Which was, there was this one day lab here in LA put on by an organization called Jews Talk Justice, which is a branch of the Tel Aviv Institute that I often talk about on this show, and I walk in, I see my usual sort of Jewish advocate faces, And then I see Metta World Peace.

So, what were you doing there that day at the Jews Talk Justice Lab?

Metta: When I first came out, and I was probably doing something in philanthropy on October 6th and October 7th happened and I'm like, oh wow, I couldn't believe my eyes. But, I'm not saying I don't respect or I'm not taking into consideration the history you know, of the Palestinian people.

I'm saying at that moment I saw something I'm like, wow, it hurt my heart. So I was probably one of the first celebrities to actually comment.

Jonah: You

Metta: know, and then, [00:10:00] so, you know, just from that perspective, you know, being at an event, I want to understand because I didn't know what Zionism was. I didn't know what anti Semitism, the actual jargon and what it meant.

Yeah. And even other cultures, I don't know different things in other cultures. I just don't know because I'm doing philanthropy. So for me, it's about learning about the different cultures.

Jonah: That's so huge. Just having that desire to learn. It's impossible for us to know everything about every culture. You just have to want to be open to learning and understanding.

And it's so great that that's what you're doing.

Metta: Yeah.

Jonah: You mentioned, uh, October 7th. That's when you like first felt you had to say something one of the first celebrities to start getting involved You wrote an amazing article for the New York Post What compelled you like in that more like I gotta I gotta write something.

I gotta put something out there

Metta: I'm definitely not for any any terrorist attack anywhere around the world Of course that one particular statement was it was catered towards what happened, you know When [00:11:00] you see a child being taken You know, if you see a mother being taken, I don't care who it is, you have to have a soft spot.

It's not something that I felt that I can just watch my fight and my, um, and my focus and my concern is like for people to be happy.

Jonah: Why is that? Like, where did that come from? Why is that your mission?

Metta: No. Why did I change my name? The world peace, you know, um, had to do, it started in 1990 when I seen the war in the Middle East as a 10 year old, I was affected.

Why? I don't know. I can't tell you, but as a 10 year old. I was affected by seeing images of other people, even though we're going through all this stuff here in America, but I was affected by that. So then that got me on thinking about things globally. But I think we got so much potential. We got, I think everybody's so focused on fighting here.

When we're forgetting about exploration, you know, we're forgetting about why we're here. And I think we're here to do [00:12:00] something special.

Jonah: Putting on my psychologist hat for a minute. Do you think the fact that your upbringing, your childhood, which we'll get into in a little bit, was so tumultuous and traumatic, do you feel like that's sort of led to you trying to devote your life to creating peace and happiness for others?

Metta: I didn't grow up, you know, in peaceful conditions or environment.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: Or even a mindset. I grew up in survival mindset, watch your back mindset, you know, and it's very, it's tiring.

Music: You

Metta: know, it's tiring to be on edge all the time. And it's like, you know what, how about we flipped that on his head? How about, you know, I think differently, which could then have somebody from a neighborhood like where I'm from thinking peacefully, thinking about academics, thinking about working with others,

Music: you know,

Metta: not being afraid to work with others, not being afraid of someone's culture, because you don't understand it.

Don't listen to [00:13:00] TV and, Oh, I'm not good enough or I can't approach this person like, Hey, sir, Hey, ma'am, I would like to intern at your place. You know, maybe you don't have the jargon, you know, but you'll get it right. And just how do we become comfortable? And for me, I want to leave confidence in people.

You know, I don't want to leave fear. The hardest part is to, you know, feel someone's pain and then try to come up with solutions. That's the hard, and that's the work I want to do.

Jonah: Your Twitter, uh, it's really like a positive place to be. I love your feed, it's like a lot of positivity, a lot of real, like, bridge building talk, a lot of love for the game and current players, which you don't always see from, you know, veteran players.

Is

Metta: that you just being you? When I first got into the The public space, I was fresh out the streets, you know, so for me, I was very standoffish. I did not want to be around people. I did not know.

Jonah: [00:14:00] Right. You know what I mean? You don't know who you can trust.

Metta: Don't know who you can trust. We're still going through things in our neighborhood and I think everybody's against us.

Right. Right. And then as I, as I learned, I'm like, I want to have my own opinion. You know, I want to meet people. You know, when we were growing up, we, cause we grew up in a box.

Music: You

Metta: would have a perception of. Um, an Asian person, a Muslim person, a Jewish person, a Jehovah witness, you know, cause you're in your own little box.

Jonah: Not like a real relationship with them, just this idea of them, yeah.

Metta: Maybe somebody said something, maybe you read something, maybe you saw something, and because other people feel like that, now you feel like that. You know, and I feel like, you know, still embrace who you are, embrace your culture, but just don't.

Have a preconceived negative opinion of a group of people. You know,

Jonah: it shouldn't be too difficult, but you know, it is for folks.

Metta: Yeah.

Jonah: So in your [00:15:00] playing days, you were famous for some pretty out there sound bites. A lot of out there sound bites. Yeah. If you want to, if you want to Google baby teeth, that's one of my favorites.

And of course, you know, malice at the palace and your struggles with mental health. Do you feel like now, the man that you are today, people that you are interacting with, like, see this new meta, or are some people still looking at you as if you're Ron from days of old?

Metta: I'm not really concerned with what people think, because as I think about what some people actually thought of me, some of these people that thought, hey, meta's a thug, they actually even said that.

When you look at their track record, only one, giving back to people, helping people, being selfish. Um, and not speaking up,

Jonah: you got them beat on all counts

Metta: on key issues. I'm like, I don't judge them. I'm no better. But when you look at my track record, okay. Yeah. From Queensbridge [00:16:00] projects grew up in a, with a mom and dad.

They separated at some point in time, grew up rough. Um, you know, took on the culture. People got a chance to see the culture through a basketball player. Which was not normal, actually seeing how real people you would call hardcore, call them rappers, whatever you want to call it, but you kind of saw it through a basketball player.

That wasn't normal. It was like, you know, how is this guy like that? But then, yeah, I wear my emotions on my sleeve, and this is really where I'm from. But then you see the transformation of the mind. Then you see somebody who's loving, somebody who's, The lead, one of the leaders of mental health push in sport, in sports,

Jonah: a hundred percent.

It

Metta: hasn't been internal mental health therapists, social workers in organizations until I made that announcement. Yeah, that's given back to the world. I [00:17:00] don't care how much money you got. I don't care who you are. You could be going through things and I wanted to let people know it's okay.

Jonah: You, you mentioned the mental health stuff in the, in the NBA and in sports now.

I know you've said that when you, before you started speaking out, you were afraid to because you knew the media would make a big deal about it. You would create this perception and then you went ahead and did it. And now, as you've said, it's normalized. It's sort of everywhere. Everyone can speak openly about it.

Do you like take a lot of pride in that? Do you feel like, yeah, I did that?

Metta: Yeah. I mean, if I came out in 2004, 2000, 2000 and say, yeah, I'm having problems. The media was, uh, kind of one funnel in that era.

Jonah: Yeah. And, no, I'm not even just the media. I feel like society, we weren't talking about that stuff yet.

Metta: It's true. He wasn't talking, nobody was talking about it. And we didn't, we didn't have much sympathy, empathy for it.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: Like I had a nervous breakdown in my rookie year. You know, I told the story a couple of times, maybe I told it on my documentary. I had a nervous, nervous breakdown on the [00:18:00] highway. You know, I had to pull over, get out the, the, the nervousness, you know, the episode, and then go to the game.

You know, because it was a lot of pressure and then on top of the pressure, I was drinking a lot of alcohol. I didn't understand that, you know, alcohol is a depressant. So I didn't understand that as a 19 year old. So that, that on top of everything. So from that perspective, I said, you know what, this is 2007.

I'm feeling better about myself. I'm seeing therapists. I'm going to tell them to tell the world. And what about the person that can't afford therapy? Right. I had concerned about that person. So I said, I'm going to go on national. I'm going to start talking about my journey. So people will feel comfortable if you don't have, if you can't afford it, at least, you know, that someone also feels like you, you know, it's so powerful.

It's so important.

Jonah: Yeah. So you coach Cal State LA women's basketball. Yes. And you talk about coaching a lot online and publicly. What do you love so much about coaching?

Metta: I love coaching. It's the number one thing in my life. [00:19:00] I started coaching. I think, well, even when I was in high school, I had a lot of great coaches that coached me.

Yeah. And one day Rick Carlisle told me I was going to be a great coach. It was 2003.

Jonah: That's a good compliment.

Metta: It was a great time. I was in practice. I'm super intense in practice at this point in my life. I think, yes, I'm the greatest defender. I'm becoming an all star. I'm a hard nose. I'm pretty good at basketball and that's it.

That's my identity. It's not a businessman. It's nothing else but that. Yeah. Then one day coach Carlisle comes into practice. Well, we're in practice. He says, Metta. Well, Ron, I tested this on him. He says, Ron, you're going to be a great coach. I said, really? It stuck with me and it gave me confidence. And I called myself a great coach.

I coached women's basketball for 10 years. I've been coaching women's basketball while I was in the NBA. After my practices, I was going to Palisades to coach under coach Torino Johnson. And [00:20:00] now he's at Cal State. So I've been coaching under him. 10 years. And I really love women's basketball. What do you love about it?

I love the fact that what one said, you can't do that. You can. I love giving a confidence that you can do everything. They said you can't, you know, women are dunking now.

Jonah: Oh yeah.

Metta: At Duke, Toby Farney from Canada. She's dunking, Candace obviously dunked, you got some girls, some girls is, um, dunking with two hands, you know, and I feel like, you know, don't train like you're beneath a guy, train like you're trying to go to play against the guy, you know, and I think you'll see an evolution, um, like I, I believe Caitlin Clarke can play, no disrespect to the guys, I really don't mean it, but I feel like she could play, On someone's team.

Maybe at the end of the bench. I'm not going to now. I'm not going to get beside myself But I feel like [00:21:00] she can make a roster.

Jonah: Yeah,

Metta: I feel like you can't leave her open,

Jonah: right?

Metta: I mean guys is getting scored on anyway

You know, yeah right now. Mm hmm. You can't guard job Marant anyway So so now here we are. I think at some point you'll see a female in NBA

Jonah: We've mentioned you changed your name, obviously, from Ron Artest to MetaWorldPeace. In the Jewish tradition, a name change signifies, like, a great evolution or transformation.

There's a biblical story where Jacob wrestles with an angel, and then God says, Your name is now Israel. That's where we get Israel from. What did your Transformation signify for you? What was that evolution?

Metta: Well, initially I was gonna change my name to so Hood. To so

Jonah: hood. Yeah. I think you made a better choice.

Metta: So Well when, when Chad Ochocinco changed his name. Right. And from Chad Johnson and Ultra, I was like, that is so cool. . Now this [00:22:00] was, this was in a time where I was 27 years old.

Jonah: Okay.

Metta: I think he did in 2007. So I was still evolving in terms of still not even knowing who I am.

Jonah: Yeah. Yeah.

Metta: So, but the names every year would change.

You know what I say? I'm gonna change my name to Soho. I said, that's dope. Then I said, I'm gonna change my name to Queensbridge. I'm gonna have Queensbridge in the back. But every year has kept evolving. And I was like, no, I'm gonna change my name to this. And then after I got with the Lakers, won a championship, I was already loving therapy at this time.

Jonah: I was

Metta: already, and then I was, I evolved from therapy to meditation.

Jonah: What kind of meditation?

Metta: Mostly my, my, my, my therapist was Indian. It was more mostly breathing meditation. And once I, once I learned how to control my breath, I was like, this, I was like, this is a gift, like literally a gift from God, because I said, I never knew I had this control.

I never knew I had control over myself. Once I realized I had control, my game got better. You know, um, you'll, you'll see when I played against the Lakers in the Houston Rockets series, that was the best player series I ever had. You'll see how I played. [00:23:00] They don't show the highlights, but pretty impressive.

We can find it on

Jonah: YouTube.

Metta: Find it on YouTube. Yeah. And then, then you go on with Phil, the Zen Master, winning the championship. And just like being grateful and saying, okay, I'm going to still change my name. So I got influenced by Buddhism,

Jonah: but

Metta: that's where meta came from. It

Jonah: means loving kindness,

Metta: loving kindness, you know, the ultimate level of love, kindness, and friendship.

Because I didn't feel like that internally. I didn't feel like I wanted to be someone's friend for a long time. I didn't want to get to know nobody. And I was like, I got to flip this on his head. And then world peace came from just being affected by the Afghanistan wall. Being affected by the war in 1990, you know, um, not necessarily putting the blame on any one person, but just like wanting to make a difference.

So initially I was going to change my name to another Buddhist Indian last name because meta is an Indian culture or Hindu culture, but I wanted to have, I [00:24:00] wanted to have something more broad there. And so the world peace came. And I was like, man, should I do it? Should I do it?

Jonah: It's a big decision.

Metta: It's a big decision.

And then I was like, man, well, when people hear the name, people always going to say world peace, they always going to be saying world peace. And I'm like, wow, I said, I can be really, really impactful. So I said, I'm going to do it. You know, and so it was, it was a thing where I have a platform to do good.

Jonah: You like call up your agent and you're like, Hey, can you get me some name change papers?

He's like, excuse me, what?

Metta: Name change, baby. Yeah. I think it costs like, we had somebody to help us. Maybe she was like 30 grand at the time to like, it's a good help. Cause I didn't know what to do.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: You know, but we got it all changed up. And, um, uh, you know, I, I thought it was worth it. I remember my first game I played was the Lakers versus the Clippers.

I was with the Lakers. I was a sixth man at this time or a seventh man. So I'm coming out. I'm going into the game and I'm like you stupid idiot.

Jonah: What have I done?

Metta: I remember getting to the scores table and literally like looking at, we was like, we was away at the Clippers [00:25:00] place And I'm just like you stupid idiot.

I'm like, please I need to change this name right now I didn't want to go into the game I feel so, it feels so embarrassing. I

Jonah: get it.

Metta: And they're like, we're in a world piece. And people are like, oh. I'm like, alright, cool, we did it.

Jonah: Just rip the bandaid off, rip the warm off, right off. Okay, so what about Panda's Friend?

That was another name change. What is that transformation?

Metta: It wasn't a name change. It was more like, um, an image. Mmm. I was going to China. I was really starting to get inspired by Buddhism because, you know, the Asian and, uh, whether you're Chinese or some Japanese and then also Indian kind of have Buddhism around that region.

So I was looking at the yin and yang symbols and the panda and the color and is just trying to bring more, you know, love. And like I said, flip the negativity on his head, turn it to a positive. And the panda's friend was more as a consumer brand,

Music: but it was

Metta: like a friend. Of [00:26:00] people. Like this brand, I'm your friend, I'm not your enemy, I'm your friend.

Jonah: The last name change, you go from Metta World Peace to Metta Sandiford Artest, so what does that one signify?

Metta: Well, my first wife, I met her when I was 15 years old in Queensbridge, on Mobb Deep's block. Nice. It was great, and we had three children together, and I have another child with another lady from Queens.

You know, we had, we were partners, we're in business together, so it was great. But I thought it was a great relationship. It was a 17 year relationship. Oh, wow. Um, I was young, not mature, which is something else I want to start talking about. Yeah. Relationships. And, you know, when I got divorced after a 17 year relationship, um, I met my new wife.

Her last name is Sandra Ford. Right. And she said, you're going to change your name to Sander for it. And I said, no, I'm not. And she said, yes, you are. And why was that important to her? I thought she was right. And for me, someone that's for women empowerment, [00:27:00] because the things I've learned on how to treat women, I've learned how to use the analogies for music that becomes culture, you know, um, the, the, the jargon, the language.

And, um, I felt like, wow, and then I've made music that was not, not disrespecting, but using language that should not be used. Um, so I became motivated, you know, to, uh, almost write my wrongs with women in general, on behalf of people that's afraid to maybe publicly want to write their wrongs as a culture, as men.

You know, it's not being soft,

Jonah: right?

Metta: You know what I mean? It's not being soft. It's about just paying homage. You know, um, the, the, the, the, we, we help creation, but women really, they carry us.

Jonah: Yeah, literally.

Metta: They literally carry us for six or nine months. You know, and that was really important to me.

Jonah: So now I [00:28:00] do want to get into a little bit of your early life back in Long Island City.

Uh, growing up in the projects, you already mentioned there was, you know, no Jews around. You just had this idea of what Jews were. Can you recall, like, the first time you actually were in community with a Jewish person? Or exposed to actual Jewish people?

Metta: My first perception of a Jewish person probably was from Scarface, Godfather.

Oh, that was probably my first, like, okay, I seen this movie, the consulate Getty, you know, you go to somebody Jewish when you need to make some money,

Jonah: right.

Metta: But then, you know, at some point in time, I wanted to learn about culture.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: I want to meet the actual people who's a part of the culture, not like reading the book.

Jonah: Yeah. Right. How did you discover basketball? Like what did being on the court mean for you growing up?

Metta: I was eight years old. Well, I was ready to get in trouble. So my dad was like, you need to, you need to release your energy. So my dad brought me to the basketball court on 12th street on mob. Deep block [00:29:00]

Jonah: lot happens on mob.

Deeps. A lot happened. I'm out of the

Metta: block. A lot happened this fast for sure. Um, but yeah, and then I remember going outside playing and that's what I, I remember not being able to put the balls in my legs and, you know, not being good, losing basketball games. I remember. Um, and then the losing, just. giving me the drive to that.

I don't, I hate losing. I hate losing because when I lose, you go home, you have, you go home, you go to sleep, a loser.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: And that bothered me. So I think that motivated me, but yeah, eight years old, my dad introduced it to me as a way to relieve energy. It wasn't to make it

Jonah: right.

Metta: And I think that was a gift and a curse because when I played the game, I played the game to relieve energy.

And to let out frustration versus playing the game to execute.

Jonah: Right. So there wasn't that pressure on you. I've got to succeed at this to change my future. It was just playing to get this energy out and to feel good.

Metta: But if you don't know how to feel good, then you're taking out any bad energy on other [00:30:00] people.

So as I learned that about myself, that's why therapy came into place. Because I don't, I don't want to play to survive. I want to play to win, you know, and to be your, and be your friend later. Right, right. Versus I don't like you and just competing and fighting and all that stuff.

Jonah: Okay, so then 1999, 16th pick of the NBA draft.

What was that moment like for you and your family?

Metta: We were in D. C. That's where the draft was. That's when, um, R. I. P. David Stern, when he was the commissioner. Yeah. He brings you up to the podium. And, um, I remember, um, the night before, ironing my dollars. Ironing your what? My ones, my, my dollar bills. Cause, at this point, I still had crumbled up dollars in my pocket.

Jonah: Okay, and you're like, I'm about to be a pro. I need to have crisp bills. I might have had

Metta: 60 or something like that. And I remember just getting ready for this moment, so I ironed all my dollars, and Baron Davis came into the, into my room, and he's looking at me, he's like, what you doing? I said, I'm ironing my money.[00:31:00]

Um, and then, you know, crying the day that we got drafted, because it was just, just having that amount of money, now I can help my family.

Jonah: When did that become a consideration for you? Like, on your path of like, Hey, I might make it as thing and I can then, you know, provide for my family and help change our situation.

I

Metta: think when I was 16, I can make it.

Jonah: So that young, when you were in high school, like this could be the real thing.

Metta: At junior year, I said, oh, well, I think I can make it. But before that, I didn't know.

Jonah: You were, you were McDonald's All American, right? Yeah, I was a McDonald's

Metta: All American.

Jonah: Yeah. So you, you were one of the best in the country.

Metta: Yeah, I was definitely one of the best in the country. You know, they tried to keep me out the game and, you know, but I was, you know, me and Elton Brand, we shared New York City Player of the Year. I was pretty good. We went, we went 27 and 0 in the city. We lost in a state, which is a, would you lose to

Jonah: any NBA guys?

Metta: Oh, I got to give these guys credit. Long Island Lutheran. Oh, I don't have to give these guys. It's brutal. Still hurts. It burns, but they, they deserved it. They played well. I have an excuse. [00:32:00] Okay. Captain Ron Artest calls his team and says, uh, Hey, let's go swimming tonight. We're going to play Marco Polo.

Jonah: This is what the night before the game? Yes. Okay.

Metta: And let's get in the jacuzzi team. And Hey, one more game before we are state champions. And guess what? We had no energy that next day.

Music: I

Metta: remember being out on the court. I'm talking to my teammates. The second we're down 20. I remember going through that moment and we came together like, like, sorry guys, like Hector Dupree.

Sorry, man. I'm so tired. I can't stop them. They deserved it. I don't want to take nothing away from Long Island Lutheran.

Jonah: Okay. One of my favorite stories about you from this, these early NBA days is that you worked at Circuit City for like a day and a half during, during your rookie season in Chicago.

Because you were, you liked hanging out there and you were buying all these DVDs and you were like, well, if I work here, I get the employee discount.

Metta: Yeah.

Jonah: Amazing [00:33:00] story. What did the manager say when you're like, yo, I'm Ron Artest. Can I please work at this circuit city?

Metta: When I first got drafted, it was 999, 000.

I have to tax 500, 000.

Jonah: Right.

Metta: Right. So I borrowed some money from the bank, whatever. You're already in debt.

Jonah: Right.

Metta: But you think, you know, you think you're 999, 000. You know, you think you're Bill Gates, right? I can buy 19

Jonah: years old.

Metta: I can buy as many Reese's pieces as I want. I can buy as many Tahitian treats.

Remember Tahitian treats back in the day? I don't know that one. Is it a New York City drink? Okay. You know, and it's like, um, but at some point in time it's like, okay, I'm buying a lot of bag of chips. I can buy lots of egg sandwiches. But at some point you start taking flights. I want to fly first class, but nope, you can't this time because.

You don't have enough money in your account this time. And then I want DVDs, 16. I get DVDs and VCRs. I'm like, hold on. I need to work at Circuit City because I'll get a 50 percent discount. So [00:34:00] when I did that, people looking at me like I was crazy. They said, you know, what are you doing working at Circuit City?

Like, because I need the discount.

Jonah: It, uh, the logic's working. I get it. . But what did, what did they say to you? Like he is like, sure. The

Metta: manager was great. I wish I re I wish, I wish I knew his name. The manager was great. He actually like, respected that I wanted to do it. Sent me through the process and hired me.

Jonah: And do you, do you remember what DVDs you got with that employee discount?

Metta: Um, probably men in black. I watched that so many times. Maybe, uh, what's that movie? Hey, you guys, what's the name of it? Uh, The Goonies? Probably The Goonies. Definitely The Goonies. Um, new movies like that I watch over and over again.

Jonah: Right on. I want to touch now on Malice at the Palace. Yeah. I, that's one of those moments in my life, like, I remember exactly where I was when I saw it. I was a freshman in college. It was fall of 2004. I was on campus, I went to UPenn in Philly, uh, in a restaurant, pizza place called Allegro's, which, sadly, just got rid of their [00:35:00] nighttime late hours, which is insane for a college campus.

Allegro's, get it together. And, I'm getting pizza, it's late, I look up on the TV and I see it going down, I'm like, holy shit. This is crazy and my takeaway when I'm watching it was very different from what like the narrative ended up being in the media I was like, I couldn't believe what the fans were doing and you know, I'm a performer.

So I'm I'm on stage a lot There's like there is a social contract there. Like we're over here. We're doing our thing And you, your thing is to be over there and to be watching what we're doing. Yeah. So, I mean, that's a real breach. It

Metta: is a breach.

Jonah: You know, big time. When the fan threw the beer at you, you're trying to calm it down.

You're trying to deescalate. Then you get a beer thrown at you. Like what switch flips in your brain? Is it that, is it that fight or flight from youth mode?

Metta: So the whole night, so we're playing well. Keep in mind. The team

Jonah: was awesome. Great team.

Metta: A lot of different things unpacked with the Pistons and the Pacers.

Yeah. Me [00:36:00] and Ben Wallace are the best defenders in the league

Jonah: at

Metta: this time. Ben already got his first defensive player of the year. And then the next year, I was up for it, but I led the league in flicking fouls and texts. Ben got it again. Another defensive player of the year. So, I'm already like, oh, I gotta get one of these.

And I gotta get an MVP. So, you know, they beat us one year. Uh, the year before prior. And they go to win the title. They beat the Lakers.

Jonah: I remember it well. They beat the Lakers. It was a terrible time for me. Yeah. It was all Karl Malone's knee.

Metta: Oh, yeah, that's true too. I heard about that. Screwed

Jonah: us.

Metta: So, the next year we come back, and I said, I'm not getting in trouble this year.

I'm not frightening anybody. I'm in therapy. I'm literally in therapy. No matter what happens, if I'm fighting somebody, if I'm getting into a fight or argument on the court, I move away. So I moved to the, when I moved to the stands, you know, um, after he went through the commotion, I went to say, okay, where am I going to sit?

There was so much commotion.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: The bench was here, the seats, they move. [00:37:00] Yeah. The only thing that was sturdy was that table. So I go to the table and I lay down. I'm like, okay, this would be over like in a minute. Ben's probably going to get ejected. The referees, the referees probably should have shared the fine because they didn't, they didn't eject anybody.

Jonah: Right?

Metta: Then you get the gentleman, John Green, who I'm a friend with, he throws a bear at me, hits me in my face. And at that point, you know, when everybody was like, oh, this is the black guy, the black guy of sports was, I don't want to get into the black guy. Yeah, but then I'm gonna have to talk about when, when, when African Americans wasn't allowed.

I don't even want to get into that. It

Jonah: has nothing to do with that. It's a guy threw a beer at you.

Metta: Yeah. You know what I mean? And then people, and then what happened was when he hit me and I, and I addressed it and then I saw people trying to make it a race thing and I'm totally against, I'm totally the opposite.

Music: You

Metta: know what I mean? So then I reached out to John, the gentleman who threw the cup, lost a lot of money because of it. And future revenue and still, uh, and still, um, [00:38:00] opportunities and not, I mean, not thrown my way. Really?

Jonah: Because of this still?

Metta: 100%. Damn. But I reached out to him because since I wanted to show people that you can have confrontation and you can talk about it and you can move on.

You know, and, and, and don't let people make things erasable

Jonah: of, of all the fallout, the, the lost money, the lost wages, the year suspension, all that stuff, like what hurts you the most

Metta: missing the games. That's the hurts. MJ hit me up. Like, you know, Hey, young fella, you're going to be all right. I'm gonna try to get you back in here.

So I thought I was going to get back in with Michael Jordan. I'm

Jonah: like, okay. It's like the only, the only battle Michael Jordan's ever lost. Apparently he lost that one. It

Metta: didn't happen. And, um, I remember just saying, just take the money, like, I just want to play

Music: because

Metta: we can, we can win a title, you know, um, I didn't start it, you know, um, another, I was going to [00:39:00] be all star.

I'm going to get defensive player of the year again. I'm going to be first team, all NBA or second team. I'm uh, I'm in another first team, all defense and opportunity to win a title. I don't need no money.

Jonah: I'm like

Metta: the money, the money hurts. Believe me, the money hurts. Take the money. I'm telling you to take the money.

But they couldn't just do it. They had to make it money and the games. At least let me come back for the playoffs.

Jonah: Right.

Metta: You know, 86 games. So, the,

Jonah: the games. Biggest suspension ever.

Metta: But it's okay. You know. Yeah.

Jonah: You have, you got, you got other accolades and then. Yeah. I got a lot

Metta: of accolades. I still got a lot.

Jonah: Speaking of accolades, which one meant the most to you? Uh, the defensive player of the year, the, the Kennedy Citizenship Award, or being an NBA champion?

Metta: Kennedy Citizenship Award. I

Jonah: knew you were going to say that.

Metta: Yeah. That award is incredible.

Jonah: What does that mean to you, winning that?

Metta: It means. That I'm becoming who I want to become.

It means we making a change. That award is so special to me. You know, I [00:40:00] raffled off my championship ring, gave all the money away to mental health institutions. I, I gave, actually gave some other awards away. But that award is one that I'm not partying with.

Jonah: Alright, gonna take a little detour now into Laker land.

Because I'm a giant Lakers fan, as anybody who has followed me for any length of time would know. Uh, I, I grew up watching Kobe. Uh, been going to the games, started with my dad, uh, almost 30 years ago. So, diehard Lakers fan. Um, playing with Kobe, playing under Phil Jackson, these are really strong, dynamic personalities.

I imagine that would have been, you know, for some people intimidating, but for you, maybe really comforting because you've got these, you know, you've got a strategy, you have a formula, you have a role. I mean, was that the experience?

Metta: Initially, it was difficult.

Jonah: Because of what? You used to be in the man.

Metta: You know, for six years of my career, I was, you know, the go to guy.

Jonah: But

Metta: going to L. A., I had to be a role player. That was tough. In my prime, it was [00:41:00] tough because in your prime, I was only averaging seven points my first year as a Laker, but I was really good.

Jonah: Right. You know, it's not all about the points. You were doing all kinds of other stuff.

Metta: Yeah, I was doing other stuff, but the year before that, in the playoffs, I was averaging 25 or 22 in the playoffs against the Lakers.

Mm

Jonah: hmm.

Metta: Now, you know, so I didn't get a chance to really show what I can do in my prime.

Jonah: Yeah, but you, you had to know that was coming, going to Kobe Bryant's team, right? Or did it catch you off guard? Did they sell you on a different vision?

Metta: No, it wasn't them. What really caught me off guard was not being able to adjust the first half of the season.

I didn't know how to be effective as a role player. The rhythm is a different rhythm.

Jonah: Totally.

Metta: You know,

Jonah: yeah, you're playing the game a different way. You play

Metta: in a different way. But I became good in the playoffs.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: And the playoffs, I found the rhythm is like the rhythm was meditate, relax. Playing the rhythm and don't look at the stats.

Just play a game.

Jonah: I've actually been to a number of your big games, including what I would say is probably, at least for [00:42:00] me and fans, the biggest. Game 5, 2010 Western Conference Finals, against the Suns. To go up three games to two, you hit the game winner at the last second, get that, that layup.

Unbelievable moment. I actually have the video to prove it.

So, what did that moment mean to you in the moment? And like, what does it mean to you now? That, that game winner.

Metta: You know, what it, what it was, was a gift from the basketball gods. Because when I was going through everything I was going through in my career. When I wasn't as friendly to my teammates. Um. Or I wasn't as outgoing to my teammates and getting in trouble and just throwing it all away because of my emotion, maybe I was going through stuff.

Maybe I had to write that people didn't know about. Maybe I could have made better decisions. I said, I said, because of this, I'm never going to win a championship. Like I want to now, here we are in 2009. I'm [00:43:00] playing with the Lakers. Got a chance to win a championship. I'm like, the basketball gods must have said you served your time.

Yeah,

Jonah: you're on, you're on the right path and they're, they're recognizing it.

Metta: It boosts my ego. I'm going to tell you that.

Jonah: Yeah, I get it.

Metta: Definitely boost my, my ego. It validated that I was good.

Jonah: You probably needed that after this whole year of playing, you know, fourth banana.

Metta: And after a whole career of just like uncertainty.

So it was just like to have that moment. You know, I, I, sometimes I, I watch the shot and I'll be like, yeah, kind of root for myself. You know, um, in the moment I was numb, the moment I didn't know what, I didn't feel anything, you know, no fans, no noise. I was having a really horrible game,

Jonah: right?

Metta: That's one of those things where when you're a role player you can't because you're, because you're playing bad.

You can't just say, oh, I'm not gonna shoot. You gotta keep shooting like the shot that's there. Mm-hmm . You might go one for 10 and the [00:44:00] fans might say, you suck. You know, and you're in your primer. I know I don't suck.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: But I'm just not the rhythm. And then I hit that shot, let us the game six. And then I, I then I had 26 in the close that game, you know, so I had, I had, I had some big moments.

That was, that was actually really cool. 'cause. I didn't really know what happened. Honestly, Kobe jumps on me, the team jumps on me. I know it's big, but not as they think is bigger than what I think it is. You know what I mean?

Jonah: They must have been psyched for you. Like they must have seen your struggles through the year, right?

And now you get this incredible historic moment. I think so. All right, little lightning round. I'll throw a couple quick ones at you. Favorite Jewish food you've ever tried? The crispy rice. Tadik, that's the rice where they cook it at the bottom and they flip it and you get that crispy top. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

So this is like a Sephardic Persian Shabbat. So you got, you got some Persian friends.

Metta: Yeah, for sure.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. Um, but actually, um, the Shabbat was mixed.

Jonah: Tell me about this Shabbat you were at. [00:45:00]

Metta: Well, I would have never thought about it until you just said that. About what? Who was there?

Versus another type of culture, Jewish Shabbat.

Jonah: Yeah, different. How many Shabbats have you been to in your day? Maybe, maybe

Metta: twelve. Okay, so a bunch. Oh, right on. Obviously, Shabbats are great. You know, just eating together, it wasn't something that we did all the time as a, you know, in our house. So we did it at one point in time, but it's not, maybe as a family.

Yeah. And we kind of, we broke up, but to do it every Friday, I think that's like something that you got to take and run with.

Jonah: Yeah, no doubt. What's the best advice a Jewish mother ever gave you?

Metta: Eat meals together, spend time with your family.

Jonah: Who's your favorite Jewish athlete?

Metta: I'm gonna go with Jordan Farmer.

Jonah: I actually just saw him at the, uh, Dodgers. World Series game one, went up to him and said, what's up? Oh, I thanked him for his Lakers service. Yeah,

Metta: absolutely. I also like Omar. I mean, um, Caspi.

Jonah: Yeah.

Metta: Yeah. He's Omri. Omri Caspi. He's um, I [00:46:00] mean, I think he was one of the first.

Jonah: He was the first. He was the

Metta: first Israeli player in the league.

Yeah, they're really good player too. They're good player. Yeah.

Jonah: Meta, thank you so much for being here, man. This was incredible. So great talking to you.

Metta: Absolutely. Thanks for having me. Appreciate you. That just happened. Thanks

Jonah: to Meta Staniford Artes for taking time out of his very busy schedule to be here with me today.

Your journey is so inspirational and I know everyone learned a lot from you listening to us. Thanks to Jews Talk Justice for putting me and Meta in the same room. Thanks to all of you out there enjoying this show. Please help us spread the word in whatever way you can. See you back here for the next fabulous episode of Being Jewish with me, Jonah Plath.